hi, I am a middle aged student, currently tangling with the Curtin University BA(Internet Studies) course and studying online - so my classroom is an online discussion board and my class mates spread Australia wide. It appears that the majority of my fellow students are older than I am so I suspect we are not the average university class :-) After reading a years worth of the archives for this list I thought I would relate the experiences of my odd group to those interested in our ongoing academic battle. A curious thing has happened in our class.... 50% of the class firmly believe that the internet is a magnificent communications tool, but refuse to believe the romantic hallucination that there is a cyberspace, we have been labelled the "nocyberspacers". 20% of the class firmly believe there is a cyberspace and the other 30% drift in between the two groups. It has made for some very interesting discussions, especially given that our lecturer is also of the "there is a cyberspace" camp. Discussion levels in this class are three times the level of discussions in my other two classes - it has been a lively debate !! In reading articles from this list and from other academic areas I have noted that there are some who don't go along with the general cyberspace idea but that the thrust of academia appears to be heavily pro cyberspace. I am interested in the thoughts of those in either camp on this issue. And what do I believe??? I suspect that there are a group of people who entered this field in the preWeb era who, generally, saw the internet as some kind of saviour that would create a benevolent global community and cure humankind of all its ills, and in this text only dawn they got a little carried away. These people are the driving force behind all these notions of virtual realities, cyber communities and cyberspace and want to believe that the internet has changed, or will change, human society. These people also tend to be overly concerned about privacy issues and the intrusion of government into their "playground". Then there are the "no cyberspacers" who see the internet in a less romantic manner. These people will tend to be from the Web era, they see the internet as a tool that enhances an individuals life in the same way that the phone, or car or electricity enhance our lives. They see the internet as something to be used, not something that will change human society. They don't expect the internet to bring about political or social reform and tend to be aware that the internet is used by a small part of human society and that it is a rich mans tool. For my first web article, "There is no cyberspace, Mr Barlow", which summarises my views on this subject.... http://www.tarik.com.au/university/ETbarlow.html I look forward to your views on this topic. Since this is my first post, you will of course be gentle with me :-) see ya, Eero Tarik (aka ET) Adelaide, South Australia