Re: [Air-L] Blizzard Forums will soon display real name
I can't help but wonder how much this move is tied to Blizzard's recent announcement that they are going to integrate Battle.net 2.0 with Facebook. My understanding is that the integration begins later this month with the beta testing for Starcraft 2. I have not found or read anything concerning the details of the deal that Blizzard and Facebook struck, but it would seem to me that a couple of things are apparent if these two services come together. 1) Facebook, by default, makes their participants' data public. If part of the idea is to integrate Friends Lists and social networks across both platforms, making Battle.net IDs public would seem to be a major part of such a move. 2) Facebook would most likely want access to Battle.net participants' data in order to monetize it, as they do with their own participants. I've grown more and more concerned about the power of companies like Facebook or Blizzard to dictate what constitutes "identitity" and how people manage their online personas. Mark Zuckerberg has used the rhetoric of "openness" and "integrity" to push Facebook's default stance of making their participants' data public. There are all sorts of scary questions about a company like Facebook deciding it has the right -- even the ethical obligation -- to determine what constitutes an online identity. For Blizzard, this seems to be expecially tricky considering their social networks are predicated upon fantasy spaces, like WoW or Starcraft. Part of the gaming experience is character creation, which includes a substantial amount of fiction that operates within the cultural contexts that attend fantasy role-playing. Thus, identities are an admixture of "the real" with fiction, and it is often impossible to really discern where the player ends and the avatar begins. Or, in many cases, some players feel their online avatars are better representations of themselves than anything they could muster in the brick and mortar world. Aspects of the fantasy role-play allow for identity exploration, and online spaces have always been far more accomodating of this kind of exploration. I doubt Blizzard will see major repercussions financially from this move, but I also doubt they understand some of the damage they might inflict upon their communities. What's worse, I'm increasingly afraid they may not care because any loss in paid subscriptions might be more than offset by potentially monetizing Battle.net participants' data -- which I highly suspect will happen, at least eventually. -- Dave Jones PhD Student Professional Writing and New Media Old Dominion University Vice Chair, SIGDOC ODU djone111@odu.edu
Blizzard and Facebook are moving fast along the social gaming path. This seems to be the consequence of a couple of assumption that have been largely done during the last years: - online experience is everyday more connected with our everyday offline experience. - we share online spaces with our real friends, with our class mates, colleagues from works etc. - we love to play with with our friends while we spend a lot of time in sns. The battle.net 2.0 will bring the gaming experience within Blizzards game to a new level of continuity with non-gaming online experience. What's wrong with that? Still not sure, but I'm wondering what's going to be the impact on the "minority" that wants to keep their gaming experience far away from their public presence or to all the role players out there. But those, anyway, are small numbers and I really don't think Blizzard or FB will think about them. l. -- Luca Rossi LaRiCA - Advanced Communication Laboratory Faculty of Sociology - "Carlo Bo" University, Urbino luca.rossi@uniurb.it T. +39 0722 305726 F. +39 0722 305727 http://larica.uniurb.it/redline
Hi, I conducted part of my research on the social aspects of World of Warcraft and had an account opened with Blizzard. Below, there is the official communication regarding Real ID which I received from Blizzard. What is interesting enough, when clicking on the FAQ link, the FAQ part is displayed in Polish (?). I used Google translate and they appear to say that, although for the game the Real ID is voluntary and optional, the people who post on the forums will appear with their real names. This move appears to question the tradition of openness linked to anonymity that Internet has. I do agree that Blizzard did their homework regarding the connectedness between online and offline, people enjoying to play with friends, and the hipe of social networking websites (as Luca noticed) and, perhaps, try to take advantage of this in the wake of the launching of StarCraftII. I speculate that all their efforts go now into the new game. Thus, they want to absorb part of the player base already at hand. And what better way to do this than by maintaining the in-game associations of players and 'transport' them to the new game? At the same time, the move will assure that the WoW forums will be kept free of unwanted 'flaming wars' and the moderators could focus on the forums of the new game. This is all just a speculation, but I am curious what do you think. "Soon, World of Warcraft® players will have access to a brand-new feature called Real ID, a completely voluntary and optional level of identity that will keep players connected across all of Battle.net®. When you and a friend mutually agree to become Real ID friends, you'll have access to a number of additional features that will enrich your social gaming experience in new and exciting ways: Real Names for Friends: Your Real ID friends will appear under their real-life names on your friends list, when chatting, communicating in-game, or viewing a character's profile. Real ID friends can also see whos on each others Real ID friends list, making it easy for players to connect with other people they know. Cross-Realm and Cross-Game Chat: With Real ID, friends can chat cross-realm and cross-faction in World of Warcraft, and will be able to chat across future Blizzard games such as StarCraft® II. Rich Presence: See additional info on your friends list about what your Real ID friends are up to in World of Warcraft and upcoming games like StarCraft II in real time. Broadcasts: Broadcast a short status message for all of your Real ID friends to see, whether you want to issue a call-to-arms or let your friends know about an important change of plans. Friend Once, See All Characters: Real ID friends will automatically see all of each other's characters on their friends list even characters created in future Blizzard games helping players stay connected with the people they enjoy playing with most. Getting Started: To send a Real ID friend request to another player, youll simply enter his or her Battle.net account name (an email address) using the Add Friend function in-game. The other player will see the pending request in their friends list, and if they accept, you will become Real ID friends with each other. Real ID Parental Controls: With the launch of Real ID, we will be updating our Parental Controls, giving parents the ability to decide whether their child can participate in Real ID. Well be sending an email to existing Parental Controls users with more information once the feature becomes available. Real ID is scheduled to launch with World of Warcraft patch 3.3.5; keep an eye on www.wow-europe.com for details. For more information on Real ID, visit the Real ID webpage or check out the Real ID FAQ. You can find out how Blizzard safeguards user information by reading our Online Privacy Policy. -The Battle.net Team'' Best regards, Dana Zabet PhD student School of Anthropology and Conservation University of Kent at Canterbury, UK ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Luca Rossi <luca.rossi@uniurb.it> Date: Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 4:46 PM Subject: Re: [Air-L] Blizzard Forums will soon display real name To: air-l <air-l@listserv.aoir.org> Blizzard and Facebook are moving fast along the social gaming path. This seems to be the consequence of a couple of assumption that have been largely done during the last years: - online experience is everyday more connected with our everyday offline experience. - we share online spaces with our real friends, with our class mates, colleagues from works etc. - we love to play with with our friends while we spend a lot of time in sns. The battle.net 2.0 will bring the gaming experience within Blizzards game to a new level of continuity with non-gaming online experience. What's wrong with that? Still not sure, but I'm wondering what's going to be the impact on the "minority" that wants to keep their gaming experience far away from their public presence or to all the role players out there. But those, anyway, are small numbers and I really don't think Blizzard or FB will think about them. l. -- Luca Rossi LaRiCA - Advanced Communication Laboratory Faculty of Sociology - "Carlo Bo" University, Urbino luca.rossi@uniurb.it T. +39 0722 305726 F. +39 0722 305727 http://larica.uniurb.it/redline _______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org Join the Association of Internet Researchers: http://www.aoir.org/
Love what you stated here. Very similar to what Bonnie Nardi of UC Irvine stated in a new blog post: http://umichpress.typepad.com/university_of_michigan_pr/2010/07/bonnie-nardi... On Jul 8, 2010, at 8:31 AM, David Jones wrote:
I've grown more and more concerned about the power of companies like Facebook or Blizzard to dictate what constitutes "identitity" and how people manage their online personas. Mark Zuckerberg has used the rhetoric of "openness" and "integrity" to push Facebook's default stance of making their participants' data public. There are all sorts of scary questions about a company like Facebook deciding it has the right -- even the ethical obligation -- to determine what constitutes an online identity.
I haven't read the WoW forums much, since I only played the game briefly, but the tone of the forums always surprised me for its viciousness (which also was problematic in terms of racism, homophobia and sexism being present)- I was a longtime reader of the forums for Final Fantasy 11, where things seemed much more civil. I don't know if it was the game, the type of player attracted, or even perhaps the fact that FF11's forums were *not* official-- Square had no such official ones, so players started them elsewhere (I read the ones on Allakhazam). I wonder if enough players are upset, if there would be greater movement towards 'independent' forums like that. Mia On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:31 PM, live <human.factor.one@gmail.com> wrote:
Love what you stated here. Very similar to what Bonnie Nardi of UC Irvine stated in a new blog post:
http://umichpress.typepad.com/university_of_michigan_pr/2010/07/bonnie-nardi...
On Jul 8, 2010, at 8:31 AM, David Jones wrote:
I've grown more and more concerned about the power of companies like
Facebook or Blizzard to dictate what constitutes "identitity" and how people manage their online personas. Mark Zuckerberg has used the rhetoric of "openness" and "integrity" to push Facebook's default stance of making their participants' data public. There are all sorts of scary questions about a company like Facebook deciding it has the right -- even the ethical obligation -- to determine what constitutes an online identity.
_______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org
Join the Association of Internet Researchers: http://www.aoir.org/
-- Mia Consalvo, Ph.D. Visiting Associate Professor Comparative Media Studies Massachusetts Institute of Technology 77 Massachusetts Avenue, Building 14N-226 Cambridge, MA 02139-4307 USA consalvo@mit.edu 617.324.1868
The forums for FFXI were kind of strange. Allakhazam was strong early on but around the 3rd expansion most discussion had moved on to Blue Gartr or other individual linkshell forums or livejournal groups. They moved because other websites were doing what Allakhazam were doing better but without forums (FFXIOnline was much more popular than alla for a while). At some point, Square itself created official forums for linkshells through their community stuff. Later, the online auction house FFXIAH also had really active forums. The same thing was around WoW. Forums like SomethingAwful's: http://grab.by/5lnD are still super active and independent discussion of WoW for people interested in the "end game" business would go to blogs to discuss things as well as individual guild forums. So I suppose to me this boils down to the casual WoW folks who find community in the official forums as well as those in the WoW "end game" who probably do not (exceptions abound here). I want to see how that will then change as the trophy trolls of trade chat and the official forums will no longer be able to completely hide like they once could. I can also see the Real ID stuff really mattering for competing end game groups on the same servers. But even then, Blizzard has minimized this competition through instancing, cross server looking for group, and other things. So in the end, I suppose i do not see real issue with the REAL ID stuff simply because Blizzard has done a lot to mitigate the possibility of internet fury that might fuel e-stalking and harassment. That said, I am also sure that for certain groups, this will be problematic. Women playing Tauren who do not talk on ventrillo or men playing women who also do not talk on ventrillo who then seduce other male players for maximum profit. Certain aspects of that culture, I am sure, Blizzard will be happy to not deal with again. I have to wonder what new uncomfortable MMO style drama would arise from this change. Nick On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:00 PM, Mia Consalvo <consalvo@ohio.edu> wrote:
I haven't read the WoW forums much, since I only played the game briefly, but the tone of the forums always surprised me for its viciousness (which also was problematic in terms of racism, homophobia and sexism being present)- I was a longtime reader of the forums for Final Fantasy 11, where things seemed much more civil. I don't know if it was the game, the type of player attracted, or even perhaps the fact that FF11's forums were *not* official-- Square had no such official ones, so players started them elsewhere (I read the ones on Allakhazam). I wonder if enough players are upset, if there would be greater movement towards 'independent' forums like that.
Mia
On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:31 PM, live <human.factor.one@gmail.com> wrote:
Love what you stated here. Very similar to what Bonnie Nardi of UC Irvine stated in a new blog post:
http://umichpress.typepad.com/university_of_michigan_pr/2010/07/bonnie-nardi...
On Jul 8, 2010, at 8:31 AM, David Jones wrote:
I've grown more and more concerned about the power of companies like
Facebook or Blizzard to dictate what constitutes "identitity" and how people manage their online personas. Mark Zuckerberg has used the rhetoric of "openness" and "integrity" to push Facebook's default stance of making their participants' data public. There are all sorts of scary questions about
a
company like Facebook deciding it has the right -- even the ethical obligation -- to determine what constitutes an online identity.
_______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org
Join the Association of Internet Researchers: http://www.aoir.org/
-- Mia Consalvo, Ph.D. Visiting Associate Professor Comparative Media Studies Massachusetts Institute of Technology 77 Massachusetts Avenue, Building 14N-226 Cambridge, MA 02139-4307 USA consalvo@mit.edu 617.324.1868 _______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org
Join the Association of Internet Researchers: http://www.aoir.org/
-- Nick LaLone Texas State University-San Marcos Systems Support / Master's Student www.beforegamedesign.com
Hey all, This may be old news to some on the list (especially since it was just linked this morning at Penny-Arcade) but there is a fairly long comment by a female gamer & MetaFilter in the thread on this issue: http://is.gd/dlBlj I'm not really certain that the author reaches any dramatic conclusions (trolling won't be discouraged, RL harassment will occur, the gaming community has racist & sexist biases that will discourage participation by minority and female players), but do think that it's a nice statement of concerns on the issue that, in the coming hours, will get quite a few more hits thanks to the aforementioned PA link & as such may soon become a more specific talking point. Best, pml On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 10:37 AM, Nick Lalone <nick.lalone@gmail.com> wrote:
The forums for FFXI were kind of strange. Allakhazam was strong early on but around the 3rd expansion most discussion had moved on to Blue Gartr or other individual linkshell forums or livejournal groups. They moved because other websites were doing what Allakhazam were doing better but without forums (FFXIOnline was much more popular than alla for a while). At some point, Square itself created official forums for linkshells through their community stuff. Later, the online auction house FFXIAH also had really active forums. The same thing was around WoW. Forums like SomethingAwful's: http://grab.by/5lnD are still super active and independent discussion of WoW for people interested in the "end game" business would go to blogs to discuss things as well as individual guild forums.
So I suppose to me this boils down to the casual WoW folks who find community in the official forums as well as those in the WoW "end game" who probably do not (exceptions abound here). I want to see how that will then change as the trophy trolls of trade chat and the official forums will no longer be able to completely hide like they once could. I can also see the Real ID stuff really mattering for competing end game groups on the same servers. But even then, Blizzard has minimized this competition through instancing, cross server looking for group, and other things. So in the end, I suppose i do not see real issue with the REAL ID stuff simply because Blizzard has done a lot to mitigate the possibility of internet fury that might fuel e-stalking and harassment.
That said, I am also sure that for certain groups, this will be problematic. Women playing Tauren who do not talk on ventrillo or men playing women who also do not talk on ventrillo who then seduce other male players for maximum profit. Certain aspects of that culture, I am sure, Blizzard will be happy to not deal with again.
I have to wonder what new uncomfortable MMO style drama would arise from this change.
Nick
On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:00 PM, Mia Consalvo <consalvo@ohio.edu> wrote:
I haven't read the WoW forums much, since I only played the game briefly, but the tone of the forums always surprised me for its viciousness (which also was problematic in terms of racism, homophobia and sexism being present)- I was a longtime reader of the forums for Final Fantasy 11, where things seemed much more civil. I don't know if it was the game, the type of player attracted, or even perhaps the fact that FF11's forums were *not* official-- Square had no such official ones, so players started them elsewhere (I read the ones on Allakhazam). I wonder if enough players are upset, if there would be greater movement towards 'independent' forums like that.
Mia
On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:31 PM, live <human.factor.one@gmail.com> wrote:
Love what you stated here. Very similar to what Bonnie Nardi of UC Irvine stated in a new blog post:
http://umichpress.typepad.com/university_of_michigan_pr/2010/07/bonnie-nardi...
On Jul 8, 2010, at 8:31 AM, David Jones wrote:
I've grown more and more concerned about the power of companies like
Facebook or Blizzard to dictate what constitutes "identitity" and how people manage their online personas. Mark Zuckerberg has used the rhetoric of "openness" and "integrity" to push Facebook's default stance of making their participants' data public. There are all sorts of scary questions about
a
company like Facebook deciding it has the right -- even the ethical obligation -- to determine what constitutes an online identity.
_______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org
Join the Association of Internet Researchers: http://www.aoir.org/
-- Mia Consalvo, Ph.D. Visiting Associate Professor Comparative Media Studies Massachusetts Institute of Technology 77 Massachusetts Avenue, Building 14N-226 Cambridge, MA 02139-4307 USA consalvo@mit.edu 617.324.1868 _______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org
Join the Association of Internet Researchers: http://www.aoir.org/
-- Nick LaLone Texas State University-San Marcos Systems Support / Master's Student www.beforegamedesign.com _______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org
Join the Association of Internet Researchers: http://www.aoir.org/
This just in... Looks like Blizzard has responded to the largely negative response to their RealID plans for their forums. They're not doing it anymore. http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=25968987278&sid=1 So, what do we take away from this? Keith.
From: plandweh@cs.cmu.edu Date: Fri, 9 Jul 2010 10:57:19 -0400 To: nick.lalone@gmail.com CC: air-l@listserv.aoir.org Subject: Re: [Air-L] Blizzard Forums will soon display real name
Hey all,
This may be old news to some on the list (especially since it was just linked this morning at Penny-Arcade) but there is a fairly long comment by a female gamer & MetaFilter in the thread on this issue: http://is.gd/dlBlj
I'm not really certain that the author reaches any dramatic conclusions (trolling won't be discouraged, RL harassment will occur, the gaming community has racist & sexist biases that will discourage participation by minority and female players), but do think that it's a nice statement of concerns on the issue that, in the coming hours, will get quite a few more hits thanks to the aforementioned PA link & as such may soon become a more specific talking point.
Best,
pml
On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 10:37 AM, Nick Lalone <nick.lalone@gmail.com> wrote:
The forums for FFXI were kind of strange. Allakhazam was strong early on but around the 3rd expansion most discussion had moved on to Blue Gartr or other individual linkshell forums or livejournal groups. They moved because other websites were doing what Allakhazam were doing better but without forums (FFXIOnline was much more popular than alla for a while). At some point, Square itself created official forums for linkshells through their community stuff. Later, the online auction house FFXIAH also had really active forums. The same thing was around WoW. Forums like SomethingAwful's: http://grab.by/5lnD are still super active and independent discussion of WoW for people interested in the "end game" business would go to blogs to discuss things as well as individual guild forums.
So I suppose to me this boils down to the casual WoW folks who find community in the official forums as well as those in the WoW "end game" who probably do not (exceptions abound here). I want to see how that will then change as the trophy trolls of trade chat and the official forums will no longer be able to completely hide like they once could. I can also see the Real ID stuff really mattering for competing end game groups on the same servers. But even then, Blizzard has minimized this competition through instancing, cross server looking for group, and other things. So in the end, I suppose i do not see real issue with the REAL ID stuff simply because Blizzard has done a lot to mitigate the possibility of internet fury that might fuel e-stalking and harassment.
That said, I am also sure that for certain groups, this will be problematic. Women playing Tauren who do not talk on ventrillo or men playing women who also do not talk on ventrillo who then seduce other male players for maximum profit. Certain aspects of that culture, I am sure, Blizzard will be happy to not deal with again.
I have to wonder what new uncomfortable MMO style drama would arise from this change.
Nick
On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:00 PM, Mia Consalvo <consalvo@ohio.edu> wrote:
I haven't read the WoW forums much, since I only played the game briefly, but the tone of the forums always surprised me for its viciousness (which also was problematic in terms of racism, homophobia and sexism being present)- I was a longtime reader of the forums for Final Fantasy 11, where things seemed much more civil. I don't know if it was the game, the type of player attracted, or even perhaps the fact that FF11's forums were *not* official-- Square had no such official ones, so players started them elsewhere (I read the ones on Allakhazam). I wonder if enough players are upset, if there would be greater movement towards 'independent' forums like that.
Mia
On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:31 PM, live <human.factor.one@gmail.com> wrote:
Love what you stated here. Very similar to what Bonnie Nardi of UC Irvine stated in a new blog post:
http://umichpress.typepad.com/university_of_michigan_pr/2010/07/bonnie-nardi...
On Jul 8, 2010, at 8:31 AM, David Jones wrote:
I've grown more and more concerned about the power of companies like
Facebook or Blizzard to dictate what constitutes "identitity" and how people manage their online personas. Mark Zuckerberg has used the rhetoric of "openness" and "integrity" to push Facebook's default stance of making their participants' data public. There are all sorts of scary questions about
a
company like Facebook deciding it has the right -- even the ethical obligation -- to determine what constitutes an online identity.
_______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org
Join the Association of Internet Researchers: http://www.aoir.org/
-- Mia Consalvo, Ph.D. Visiting Associate Professor Comparative Media Studies Massachusetts Institute of Technology 77 Massachusetts Avenue, Building 14N-226 Cambridge, MA 02139-4307 USA consalvo@mit.edu 617.324.1868 _______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org
Join the Association of Internet Researchers: http://www.aoir.org/
-- Nick LaLone Texas State University-San Marcos Systems Support / Master's Student www.beforegamedesign.com _______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org
Join the Association of Internet Researchers: http://www.aoir.org/
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_________________________________________________________________ The New Busy think 9 to 5 is a cute idea. Combine multiple calendars with Hotmail. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?tile=multicalendar&ocid=PID28...
The Wall Street Journal (digits) also had a brief article (http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2010/07/07/real-names-rile-online-warlocks-and- wizards/) on this, which triggered plenty of comments there Regards, Jana -----Original Message----- From: air-l-bounces@listserv.aoir.org [mailto:air-l-bounces@listserv.aoir.org] On Behalf Of Pete[r] Landwehr Sent: Friday, July 09, 2010 4:57 PM To: Nick Lalone Cc: air-l@listserv.aoir.org Subject: Re: [Air-L] Blizzard Forums will soon display real name Hey all, This may be old news to some on the list (especially since it was just linked this morning at Penny-Arcade) but there is a fairly long comment by a female gamer & MetaFilter in the thread on this issue: http://is.gd/dlBlj I'm not really certain that the author reaches any dramatic conclusions (trolling won't be discouraged, RL harassment will occur, the gaming community has racist & sexist biases that will discourage participation by minority and female players), but do think that it's a nice statement of concerns on the issue that, in the coming hours, will get quite a few more hits thanks to the aforementioned PA link & as such may soon become a more specific talking point. Best, pml On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 10:37 AM, Nick Lalone <nick.lalone@gmail.com> wrote:
The forums for FFXI were kind of strange. Allakhazam was strong early on but around the 3rd expansion most discussion had moved on to Blue Gartr or other individual linkshell forums or livejournal groups. They moved because other websites were doing what Allakhazam were doing better but without forums (FFXIOnline was much more popular than alla for a while). At some point, Square itself created official forums for linkshells through their community stuff. Later, the online auction house FFXIAH also had really active forums. The same thing was around WoW. Forums like SomethingAwful's: http://grab.by/5lnD are still super active and independent discussion of WoW for people interested in the "end game" business would go to blogs to discuss things as well as individual guild forums.
So I suppose to me this boils down to the casual WoW folks who find community in the official forums as well as those in the WoW "end game" who probably do not (exceptions abound here). I want to see how that will then change as the trophy trolls of trade chat and the official forums will no longer be able to completely hide like they once could. I can also see the Real ID stuff really mattering for competing end game groups on the same servers. But even then, Blizzard has minimized this competition through instancing, cross server looking for group, and other things. So in the end, I suppose i do not see real issue with the REAL ID stuff simply because Blizzard has done a lot to mitigate the possibility of internet fury that might fuel e-stalking and harassment.
That said, I am also sure that for certain groups, this will be problematic. Women playing Tauren who do not talk on ventrillo or men playing women who also do not talk on ventrillo who then seduce other male players for maximum profit. Certain aspects of that culture, I am sure, Blizzard will be happy to not deal with again.
I have to wonder what new uncomfortable MMO style drama would arise from this change.
Nick
On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:00 PM, Mia Consalvo <consalvo@ohio.edu> wrote:
I haven't read the WoW forums much, since I only played the game briefly, but the tone of the forums always surprised me for its viciousness (which also was problematic in terms of racism, homophobia and sexism being present)- I was a longtime reader of the forums for Final Fantasy 11, where things seemed much more civil. I don't know if it was the game, the type of player attracted, or even perhaps the fact that FF11's forums were *not* official-- Square had no such official ones, so players started them elsewhere (I read the ones on Allakhazam). I wonder if enough players are upset, if there would be greater movement towards 'independent' forums like that.
Mia
On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:31 PM, live <human.factor.one@gmail.com> wrote:
Love what you stated here. Very similar to what Bonnie Nardi of UC Irvine stated in a new blog post:
http://umichpress.typepad.com/university_of_michigan_pr/2010/07/bonnie-nardi -is-author-of-my-life-as-a-night-elf-priest-a-new-book-on-the-culture-and-ga meplay-in-the-international-bestsell.html
On Jul 8, 2010, at 8:31 AM, David Jones wrote:
I've grown more and more concerned about the power of companies like
Facebook or Blizzard to dictate what constitutes "identitity" and how people manage their online personas. Mark Zuckerberg has used the rhetoric of "openness" and "integrity" to push Facebook's default stance of making their participants' data public. There are all sorts of scary questions
about a
company like Facebook deciding it has the right -- even the ethical obligation -- to determine what constitutes an online identity.
_______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org
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-- Mia Consalvo, Ph.D. Visiting Associate Professor Comparative Media Studies Massachusetts Institute of Technology 77 Massachusetts Avenue, Building 14N-226 Cambridge, MA 02139-4307 USA consalvo@mit.edu 617.324.1868 _______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org
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Update! The negative discourse has resulted in a reversal of their plans. Blizzard's CEO announced today, via their WoW forums, that "at this time... real names will NOT be required for posting on official Blizzard forums." http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=25968987278&sid=1 However, a Real ID option will still be available for in-game communications at players' discretion, which may enhance future functionalities not yet detailed (marking a shift to incentivized disclosure?). -brady -- Albert Brady Curlew, Ph.D Candidate Joint Graduate Programme in Communication & Culture York University & Ryerson University, Toronto, ON TA Social Science 2312: Information & Technology Quoting Jana Diesner <diesner@cs.cmu.edu>:
The Wall Street Journal (digits) also had a brief article (http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2010/07/07/real-names-rile-online-warlocks-and- wizards/) on this, which triggered plenty of comments there
Regards, Jana
-----Original Message----- From: air-l-bounces@listserv.aoir.org [mailto:air-l-bounces@listserv.aoir.org] On Behalf Of Pete[r] Landwehr Sent: Friday, July 09, 2010 4:57 PM To: Nick Lalone Cc: air-l@listserv.aoir.org Subject: Re: [Air-L] Blizzard Forums will soon display real name
Hey all,
This may be old news to some on the list (especially since it was just linked this morning at Penny-Arcade) but there is a fairly long comment by a female gamer & MetaFilter in the thread on this issue: http://is.gd/dlBlj
I'm not really certain that the author reaches any dramatic conclusions (trolling won't be discouraged, RL harassment will occur, the gaming community has racist & sexist biases that will discourage participation by minority and female players), but do think that it's a nice statement of concerns on the issue that, in the coming hours, will get quite a few more hits thanks to the aforementioned PA link & as such may soon become a more specific talking point.
Best,
pml
On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 10:37 AM, Nick Lalone <nick.lalone@gmail.com> wrote:
The forums for FFXI were kind of strange. Allakhazam was strong early on but around the 3rd expansion most discussion had moved on to Blue Gartr or other individual linkshell forums or livejournal groups. They moved because other websites were doing what Allakhazam were doing better but without forums (FFXIOnline was much more popular than alla for a while). At some point, Square itself created official forums for linkshells through their community stuff. Later, the online auction house FFXIAH also had really active forums. The same thing was around WoW. Forums like SomethingAwful's: http://grab.by/5lnD are still super active and independent discussion of WoW for people interested in the "end game" business would go to blogs to discuss things as well as individual guild forums.
So I suppose to me this boils down to the casual WoW folks who find community in the official forums as well as those in the WoW "end game" who probably do not (exceptions abound here). I want to see how that will then change as the trophy trolls of trade chat and the official forums will no longer be able to completely hide like they once could. I can also see the Real ID stuff really mattering for competing end game groups on the same servers. But even then, Blizzard has minimized this competition through instancing, cross server looking for group, and other things. So in the end, I suppose i do not see real issue with the REAL ID stuff simply because Blizzard has done a lot to mitigate the possibility of internet fury that might fuel e-stalking and harassment.
That said, I am also sure that for certain groups, this will be problematic. Women playing Tauren who do not talk on ventrillo or men playing women who also do not talk on ventrillo who then seduce other male players for maximum profit. Certain aspects of that culture, I am sure, Blizzard will be happy to not deal with again.
I have to wonder what new uncomfortable MMO style drama would arise from this change.
Nick
On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:00 PM, Mia Consalvo <consalvo@ohio.edu> wrote:
I haven't read the WoW forums much, since I only played the game briefly, but the tone of the forums always surprised me for its viciousness (which also was problematic in terms of racism, homophobia and sexism being present)- I was a longtime reader of the forums for Final Fantasy 11, where things seemed much more civil. I don't know if it was the game, the type of player attracted, or even perhaps the fact that FF11's forums were *not* official-- Square had no such official ones, so players started them elsewhere (I read the ones on Allakhazam). I wonder if enough players are upset, if there would be greater movement towards 'independent' forums like that.
Mia
On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:31 PM, live <human.factor.one@gmail.com> wrote:
Love what you stated here. Very similar to what Bonnie Nardi of UC Irvine stated in a new blog post:
http://umichpress.typepad.com/university_of_michigan_pr/2010/07/bonnie-nardi -is-author-of-my-life-as-a-night-elf-priest-a-new-book-on-the-culture-and-ga meplay-in-the-international-bestsell.html
On Jul 8, 2010, at 8:31 AM, David Jones wrote:
I've grown more and more concerned about the power of companies like
Facebook or Blizzard to dictate what constitutes "identitity" and how people manage their online personas. Mark Zuckerberg has used the rhetoric of "openness" and "integrity" to push Facebook's default stance of making their participants' data public. There are all sorts of scary questions
about a
company like Facebook deciding it has the right -- even the ethical obligation -- to determine what constitutes an online identity.
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-- Mia Consalvo, Ph.D. Visiting Associate Professor Comparative Media Studies Massachusetts Institute of Technology 77 Massachusetts Avenue, Building 14N-226 Cambridge, MA 02139-4307 USA consalvo@mit.edu 617.324.1868 _______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org
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-- Nick LaLone Texas State University-San Marcos Systems Support / Master's Student www.beforegamedesign.com _______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers http://aoir.org Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org
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participants (10)
-
Albert Brady Curlew -
David Jones -
Felicia Ghergu -
Jana Diesner -
Keith Cormier -
live -
Luca Rossi -
Mia Consalvo -
Nick Lalone -
Pete[r] Landwehr