Nadia, I was confused by that sentence too. It’s very oddly worded and this feels very fluid to me… Best, Charles From: Air-L <air-l-bounces@listserv.aoir.org> on behalf of Nadia Tjahja via Air-L <air-l@listserv.aoir.org> Date: Monday, August 7, 2023 at 1:34 PM To: Colin Delany <cpd@epolitics.com> Cc: air-l <air-l@listserv.aoir.org>, Colin Delany <cpd@his.com> Subject: Re: [Air-L] fyi: Zoom claims right to use your sessions to train AI Dear colleagues, I’m not very familiar with the legalese but under section 10.4 it says: *Notwithstanding the above, Zoom will not use audio, video or chat Customer Content to train our artificial intelligence models without your consent.* Is that meant to indicate that they automatically do not use content to train? Or that they will ask specific consent if they do want to use it for training? Or that signing the agreement automatically provides consent? It’s not quite clear to me. Kind regards, Nadia On Mon, 7 Aug 2023 at 19:39, Colin Delany via Air-L <air-l@listserv.aoir.org> wrote:
I suspect that the best chance of stopping this is publicity. The more media coverage of it, the better.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Joseph Reagle via Air-L" <air-l@listserv.aoir.org> To: "Robert W Gehl" <lists@robertwgehl.org>, "air-l" < air-l@listserv.aoir.org> Sent: Monday, August 7, 2023 1:07:17 PM Subject: Re: [Air-L] fyi: Zoom claims right to use your sessions to train AI
My hope is that large institutions -- such as universities -- have licenses that would not permit this...? ---Joseph
On 8/7/23 11:35, Robert W Gehl via Air-L wrote:
Hi, rick --
Thanks for sharing this. I saw your post on the fediverse, and following your lead, read the relevant section. In my professional opinion: Zoom's claim to our voice and face data for training AI is super gross.
People may wonder: what do we do instead of Zoom? One answer I could point to is Nextcloud. I host my own Nextcloud server and I regularly use its Talk application to do video chats -- in fact, I just got off a call with an interviewee for my book project.
For those of you who don't self-host and want to rely on university or institutional licenses, Nextcloud could be something to point to when you talk to your admins about where to go if Zoom is no longer attractive.
There are obviously other alternatives (e.g., Jitsi) but I can personally say Nextcloud has done well for me.
- Rob
On 2023-08-07 07:47, Richard Forno via Air-L wrote:
Hi folks -
As I posted to rickf@indieweb.social <mailto:rickf@indieweb.social> yesterday, for those who may be using Zoom for teaching, research, external collaborations and/or personal meetings, please note that their latest terms of service (7/27/23) sections 10.1 - 10.4 seems to give them the right to use the audio/video/shared content from your Zoom sessions to train AI models.[1] I'm not aware of any opt-out to this collection. This item began surfacing over the weekend so more coverage in the coming days is likely as the tech & privacy communities digest the potential legal, medical, educational, and IP ramifications of this practice.
Just providing a heads-up for AoIRistas concerned with how their (potentially sensitive) data, voice, and/or likeness - or those of their friends, family, students, or collaborators - may be used by a third party. IIRC BlueSky claims something similar with content posted on that platform, but imo that's not as far-reaching or potentially invasive as this move by Zoom.
<sigh> One wonders if there are any internet ethics folks employed & empowered @ these places anymore, but I'm not optimistic. :/
-- rick
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-- *Ms Nadia Tjahja* United Nations University – CRIS | Digital Governance Cluster | Co-Coordinator of the Digital Governance Cluster & PhD Fellow https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.cris.unu.edu__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fCjyDTTLKkt_T9XIqyr-PJBnmF5a7ceewkfB0QKHoWdCupuvwQQfZ-jhPIaBOH6NWcRf4WDfhl53XAeVJqvSr1k$<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/www.cris.unu.edu__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fCjyDTTLKkt_T9XIqyr-PJBnmF5a7ceewkfB0QKHoWdCupuvwQQfZ-jhPIaBOH6NWcRf4WDfhl53XAeVJqvSr1k$> Vrije Universiteit Brussel | Brussels School of Governance | PhD Researcher https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://brussels-school.be/research/digitalisation-democracy-and-innovation__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fCjyDTTLKkt_T9XIqyr-PJBnmF5a7ceewkfB0QKHoWdCupuvwQQfZ-jhPIaBOH6NWcRf4WDfhl53XAeVRpC0XIw$<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/brussels-school.be/research/digitalisation-democracy-and-innovation__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fCjyDTTLKkt_T9XIqyr-PJBnmF5a7ceewkfB0QKHoWdCupuvwQQfZ-jhPIaBOH6NWcRf4WDfhl53XAeVRpC0XIw$> Communications Chair, Global Internet Governance Academic Network (GigaNet) YOUthDIG Coordinator, European Dialogue on Internet Governance (EuroDIG) *Recent publications* Tjahja, N., Meyer, T., Shahin, J., (2022). Who do you think you are? Individual stakeholder identification and mobility at the Internet Governance Forum. *Telecommunications Policy**, 46*(10*)**,* 102410. https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://doi.org/10.1016/j.telpol.2022.102410__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fCjyDTTLKkt_T9XIqyr-PJBnmF5a7ceewkfB0QKHoWdCupuvwQQfZ-jhPIaBOH6NWcRf4WDfhl53XAeVwYxSX_I$<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/doi.org/10.1016/j.telpol.2022.102410__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fCjyDTTLKkt_T9XIqyr-PJBnmF5a7ceewkfB0QKHoWdCupuvwQQfZ-jhPIaBOH6NWcRf4WDfhl53XAeVwYxSX_I$> Tjahja, N., Meyer, T., & Shahin, J. (2021). What is civil society and who represents civil society at the IGF? An analysis of civil society typologies in internet governance. *Telecommunications Policy*, *45*(6), 102141. doi:10.1016/j.telpol.2021.102141 <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://doi.org/10.1016/j.telpol.2021.102141__;!... > _______________________________________________ The Air-L@listserv.aoir.org mailing list is provided by the Association of Internet Researchers https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://aoir.org__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fCjyDTTLKkt_T9XIqyr-PJBnmF5a7ceewkfB0QKHoWdCupuvwQQfZ-jhPIaBOH6NWcRf4WDfhl53XAeVj0AKmis$<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/aoir.org__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fCjyDTTLKkt_T9XIqyr-PJBnmF5a7ceewkfB0QKHoWdCupuvwQQfZ-jhPIaBOH6NWcRf4WDfhl53XAeVj0AKmis$> Subscribe, change options or unsubscribe at: https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fCjyDTTLKkt_T9XIqyr-PJBnmF5a7ceewkfB0QKHoWdCupuvwQQfZ-jhPIaBOH6NWcRf4WDfhl53XAeViYjtOVA$<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/listserv.aoir.org/listinfo.cgi/air-l-aoir.org__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fCjyDTTLKkt_T9XIqyr-PJBnmF5a7ceewkfB0QKHoWdCupuvwQQfZ-jhPIaBOH6NWcRf4WDfhl53XAeViYjtOVA$> Join the Association of Internet Researchers: https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.aoir.org/__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fCjyDTTLKkt_T9XIqyr-PJBnmF5a7ceewkfB0QKHoWdCupuvwQQfZ-jhPIaBOH6NWcRf4WDfhl53XAeVX7menqc$<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/www.aoir.org/__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fCjyDTTLKkt_T9XIqyr-PJBnmF5a7ceewkfB0QKHoWdCupuvwQQfZ-jhPIaBOH6NWcRf4WDfhl53XAeVX7menqc$>